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NJ SCALE Racing June Porsche 917 race results

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  • NJ SCALE Racing June Porsche 917 race results

    here are the results of the June 21, 2014 NJ SCALE Racing BRM Porsche 917 race:

    1) Martin Dixon.........145 laps......7.078223.......yellow lane...**fastest lap time winner**
    2) Glenn Orban.........142 laps......7.249553.......yellow lane...
    3) Robert Holt...........142 laps......7.249831.......yellow lane...
    4) Mike Burke............140 laps.....7.249368.......white lane
    5) Arron Moore..........139 laps.....7.249968.......purple lane
    6) Jim Regan.............138 laps.....7.249732.......purple lane
    7) Mario Baskin (no-s).111 lane

    Lots to say about these new BRM Porsche 917s. This was our first official 917 race, and it was a blast! I raced a factory painted rtr car, and with the green 41t aluminum gear, the car on The Red Lightning track, which is a long track, was not to my liking. This gearing had the car reach full speed halfway down the main straight, and was jumpy. (On my shorter home Carrera track, this car with the 41t spur gear races perfect, and is quick.) But, when I switched to the 38t nylon gear (white), the car really woke up, then added some lead weights to the inside of the chassis, and I was racing a really great handling car now. We had 3 other cars that had gear failure, all with the blue 38t gear. All cars using the white 38t nylon spur gear had no gear failure issues.

    Martin had the most weight in his car and it proved to be faster in the turns, but not faster in the straights, so he pulled away with a 3 lap first place finish. Now take a look at the 2nd-6th place finishers: we all had fastest lap times in the 7.249 range- now that is what I call evenly matched cars!!

    And for our first Porsche 917 race, with many cars on the track for the first time, there was no real body damage or horrible crashes, just blue nylon gear failure. So we expect that as the motors break in, as we get used to racing this car, which handles much differently than the Group-C cars, and as we get better at tuning the chassis (lead weights, axle height adjustments) to see even lower lap times, possibly breaking into the 6's.

    The other difference in these cars vs the Group-C cars- this gearing gives us some serious brakes!! We also had initial track testing with 1 Toyota Group-C car with the new anglewinder chassis, and 1 new Sauber Mercedes. The Sauber-Mercedes is FAST! We did not record lap times, but that car seemed very quick and will be added to our Group-C class races. Now I need to get one for myself...

    And Mario Baskin (not Baskins...) gets a gold star for not giving up- his car, with one of the blue nylon spur gears, ended the race with less teeth on the gear than were missing- we don't know how he did it! I think his car finally died (or should I say the spur gear died) with approx. 1-1/2 minutes left in the final heat. His car sounded like a can opener at the end of the race

    But seriously folks- everyone did really well for the first race with a totally new car. Out of the box, these new Porsche 917s are fantastic!! Just add foam rubber rears, some lead weights to the chassis, adjust front wheel ride height as needed, gearing for your track (41t if a short course, 38t spur if a longer course), and you will be pleased.

    Well done BRM...

    note there are 3 factory painted cars and the rest are custom painted white kits, all beauties
    Last edited by sportblazer350; 06-22-2014, 08:50 PM.

  • #2
    Very interesting and informative info. Was this with the pink motor? Due you think the blue gear is defective or did it have to due with accidents?
    Regarding added weight how much and where for a starting point?
    Thanks ~Ron


    • #3
      Set up and grip

      I do not think the metal gears from BRM were a problem, however on high grip tracks if there is too much lash in the gear they will get torn up.
      Especially on tracks with spray glue, and sponge tires and added weight.
      All of these factors add up to more load on the gears.

      The blue nylon gears are on the light side for a Commercial set up with high grip, however the latest glass re- enforced gears should be fine.

      The later glass re-enforced nylon gears are more tolerant, but still if there is too much rock ( lash ) in the gear set up that is hard on teeth. Also side float in the rear axle will change gear mesh. Not as critical as the in line gears but still important. Even more so on a high grip track.
      BRM is not producing the metal gears now having switched over to the stronger nylon versions.

      Some of the cars will still come with these, and if racing with sponge tires you may want to consider trying the latest gears.

      Also we will be keeping the BRM Classic Class racing with the purple motor and the BRM Sponge tires, not Scaleauto tires for this class of car. These tires are more true to scale size for the 917 and a little less bite, which also helps the drive train.

      Which tires did you run, and how much weight was added. Also what motor did you use.

      Great to see you racing the 917's they are a fun class, which will be even better once BRM releases a car to race against them
      Last edited by Scaleracing; 06-23-2014, 12:50 PM.
      Alan Smith
      SCI Owner.



      • #4
        Alan, with the anglewinder does it make a difference where the spur gear hits on the pinion, ie end or middle as long as there isn't a big gap? ~Ron


        • #5
          Ideally close to the can bearing.

          As close to the motor as possible, as the further out on the pinion the more deflection and load on the motor bearing.
          I read the original post wrong as they were talking about the blue nylon spur which came on the white kits. Those and the later metal spurs have been replaced in production now with the latest opaque nylon spurs. These have been strong here, both on 917 and Group C cars.
          Still side float in the axle as close to zero as possible. Then set lash to as close to zero at the tightest spot.
          When converting BRM cars to these latest gears please make sure the axle is free from burrs, and avoid pressing hard on the gear to mount.
          Alan Smith
          SCI Owner.



          • #6
            again: NO issues with the NEW white nylon (?) anglewinder gears at all, just the blue gears had the issues as pictured, and only 3 of the group of white kit cars, note that some racers using the blue gear had no issues at all.

            We race the cars with the motors that come with them. Lead weights- did not have a scale- we used $1 self adhesive issues from the commercial raceways. Weights added under the interior and along the sides only. We raced on a commercial track, long main straight, light spray glue. For now we are allowing either Scaleauto or BRM rears, as we were limited to supply. Now we have a more fully stocked parts inventory at The Race Place, so we will be promoting the use of the BRm 917 foam rubber rears in the future.

            My rtr car had the 41t green aluminum gear, which is ok, but only for a short track, that gear ratio was not good for this longer layout, so I switched to the new issue white gear. I kept is tight, no side to side play at all, made sure there was free play without any binding, and that set up held through the entire race.

            One thing I discovered after I took off the body after the race: one front axle post was cracked, so I need to remove the front axle, bushing and set screws and try to re-glue it. Not sure if it cracked due to an accident or due to how I had the front axle height adjusted, but I assume due to an accident. Hopefully this is not an indication of these chassis cracking, will check with the other racers and see if anyone else had any chassis damage after the race.

            Conclusions: this is a fantastic car class to race. Easy to tune and set up, just depends on the type of track/layout you are racing on. On my smaller Carrera track, with a 41t spur gear, this car is a rocket at 12 volts, and handles great, without any added weights in the chassis.

            For those of us that race BRM cars (anglewinder or inline chassis) on commercial tracks with spray glue (light pref.) we do need gears that will endure hard racing. BRM cars really perform well on commercial tracks, you just need to balance the chassis, set it up for your track conditions (rear wheel type/compound, front axle height, guide flag depth, type of braid(thick, thin, narrow, or wide) added chassis weights if needed, gear ratio, and gear lash. Reinforce body with Shoo Goo, and you are ready to race!


            • #7
              One thing I discovered after I took off the body after the race: one front axle post was cracked, so I need to remove the front axle, bushing and set screws and try to re-glue it. Not sure if it cracked due to an accident or due to how I had the front axle height adjusted, but I assume due to an accident. Hopefully this is not an indication of these chassis cracking, will check with the other racers and see if anyone else had any chassis damage after the race.
              Please if possible photograph the cracked area. If around the grub screws on all the angle winder ( adjustable front end ) chassis it is easy to crack where the screw goes through the upright. Normally this is done by tightening the grub screw underneath till it overloads the upper screw, take care when tightening these do not clamp the bearing as this loads the chassis.
              If you over tighten the grub screws you can easily split the chassis at the adjustment threads, please advise racers not to clamp the front axle bearing tight as the next small turn overloads the chassis uprights, they are not metal, something has to give.

              Glad you all had fun, also glad to hear the glass re-enforced gears hold up for you as they do here and in all BRM testing.
              Alan Smith
              SCI Owner.



              • #8
                My observation is. ........
                Last edited by dinky; 06-25-2014, 07:59 PM.


                • #9
                  I was ging to say Billy

                  To the ide mind, but now I am lost.
                  Still great to see you guys racing the BRM cars, let me know if you have other issues. Slot Car related of course.......................................
                  Alan Smith
                  SCI Owner.



                  • #10
                    Nice race
                    Last edited by dinky; 06-30-2014, 01:48 PM.


                    • #11
                      917 chassis cracks update

                      so back to my Porsche 917 after race chassis damage: cracked front axle uprights. Found, after taking apart the front axle, wheels, tires, bushings, axle, spacers, grub screws: both posts were cracked. Found that the front axle was frozen tight in one of the brass bushings! After removing the bushing (needed to tap it out using my bench vise) the front axle had some type of (not sure what? glue? ) coating?? something?? on it, and that caused the front axle to be frozen stuck in the bushing, so the bushing was spinning when the wheels were turning. I did not notice this when the car was new, as I never took apart the front axle assembly until now, so not sure if I spilled Super Glue or it came this way from the factory?

                      Anyway, I cleaned up the front axle, cleaned out and deburred the front bushing, so the front axle is pinning freely in the bushings now. I had both bushings mounted tight with the top and bottom grub screws, so now they are a bit looser, with some free play, thanks to Alan's suggestion. So if the front axle was stuck in the bushing, and that was spinning as the front tires were spinning, and I had the set screws tight against the bushings, that may have caused the front axle upright to crack under race conditions. Glued the cracks, so I am ready for the next race, and will update this post after that race, when I tear down the car for cleaning and lubrication post race.

                      anglewinder gear in perfect form, no side to side play, no wear issues, no gear damage. Again, this new 917 is a winner, a great car, and vast upgrade to the BRM line. Can't wait to race them again!


                      • #12
                        SUPER GLUE ? What on earth would you be doing with super glue near a brand new car?lol see you soon.
                        Last edited by dinky; 07-08-2014, 08:17 PM.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by dinky View Post
                          SUPER GLUE ? What on earth would you be doing with super glue near a brand new car?lol see you soon.
                          that's why I have so my ??? marks- I am not sure what substance was on the front axle, or how/when it got there? a factory defect? I spilled glue?? alien abduction . I have used Super Glue, just a dot, to hold the lead wires on the chassis where they pass through the pins near the front axle, so it stays flat and does not pop up and bind during racing.