....as has been discussed above is that when Nascar allowed the major manufacturers to "design" their own cars, it became a major headache for Nascar to administrate.
It is history people, it has already happened and IT DIDN'T WORK. Ford would gripe about Chevy, Chevy would gripe about Dodge, Dodge would gripe about Ford, with NO EQUITABLE CONCLUSION.
Great concept in theory, but it doesn't/didn't work. Nascar was CONSTANTLY tweaking the rules to fix the latest factory "trick" and try to keep the racing half-way competitive.
I think it was Einstein who defined insanity as trying the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.
4.048 miles at Road America is longer than 3.804 miles at Bathurst.
Your comparison of a 620 mile race is invalid, like apples and oranges, might as well thrown in the 24 hour races at LeMans or Daytona. A 620 mile race with 2 or 3 driver teams is not at all comparable to a 600 mile race with single drivers.
And the Nascar Cup cars are faster than ever....with the exception of pre-restrictor plate records at Daytona and Talledega. A few weeks ago nearly the entire qualifying field broke the existing Q record at Pocono, I believe it was the top 40-41 cars.
As far as the declining attendence, its the economy more than anything. If you do want to blame a Nascar factor, blame it on Jimmy Johnson winning 5 consecutive championships. 2011 with Tony winning and Jimmy off the radar was a refreshing change and the BEST NASCAR season EVER!! What other racing series, anywhere on this planet, is as close and exciting, week in/week out as Nascar? NONE
TV shows EVERY cause for debris cautions. Pit lane speeds are tracked electronically and are foolproof, no human factor at all. COTs might be ugly, but they are not slow. Nascar is faster than ever, except for a few non-restricted races at Daytona and Talledega years ago.
Other manufacturers?? Toyota has done OK, but far from dominated to the detrement of American brands.
I am retired so I watch just about every race that is broadcast regardless of car type or venue, although I do draw the line at getting up at 3 am to watch a Chinese F1 race. I listen to NASCAR satellite radio in my car and I personally attend several races, dirt track midgets and sprints, every year.
I have been a race fan for over 50 years, I don't know it all, but I know a bunch.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesla
....lap length not number of laps...gezzz read what I write. We are talking cars not drivers. Try to stay on topic. 620 miles is more than 600 miles unless your using some kind of new math.
Why can you not do a little research.....attendance has dropped significantly since the introduction of the COT cars. The fan base obviously, and I agree, has less interest in the tunnel blobs than stock bodied car....Heck even a silhouette like a Group 5 would have worked better and satisfied any aero needs.
Seriously, do you ever watch any other type of racing?.....The people running Nascar are not gods. They screw up all the time(phantom debris, stupid pit lane violations, etc.) and the COT is their biggest to date......Slow ugly billboards designed for a show, not competitive racing as seen else where in the world. What Nascar was really worried about was a way to deter Audi, BMW, and Mercedes from coming in and blowing the American manufactures 'doors' off.....well maybe not Ford since they have a long and successful history competing on the world stage.
....be sure and keep the blinders on it's a big scary world for those in denial.
4.048 miles at Road America is longer than 3.804 miles at Bathurst.
Ahh....not a roundy round track though is it?.....
Your comparison of a 620 mile race is invalid, like apples and oranges, might as well thrown in the 24 hour races at LeMans or Daytona. A 620 mile race with 2 or 3 driver teams is not at all comparable to a 600 mile race with single drivers.
Of course it's valid, 620 is more than 600 and stay on topic, please we are discussing cars not drivers........ and the 'Ring' is 13 miles per lap.....
And the Nascar Cup cars are faster than ever....with the exception of pre-restrictor plate records at Daytona and Talledega. A few weeks ago nearly the entire qualifying field broke the existing Q record at Pocono, I believe it was the top 40-41 cars.
Wrong Again.....The '70 Daytona Chargers lapped Daytona at 200+ mile an hour.....
As far as the declining attendence, its the economy more than anything. If you do want to blame a Nascar factor, blame it on Jimmy Johnson winning 5 consecutive championships. 2011 with Tony winning and Jimmy off the radar was a refreshing change and the BEST NASCAR season EVER!! What other racing series, anywhere on this planet, is as close and exciting, week in/week out as Nascar? NONE
Not the economy......the drop started long before 2010.....
TV shows EVERY cause for debris cautions. Pit lane speeds are tracked electronically and are foolproof, no human factor at all. COTs might be ugly, but they are not slow. Nascar is faster than ever, except for a few non-restricted races at Daytona and Talledega years ago.
Still wrong....see above....
Other manufacturers?? Toyota has done OK, but far from dominated to the detrement of American brands.
Only because they have chosen not to join under the COT cars....not enough brand recognition with the blobs.....
I am retired so I watch just about every race that is broadcast regardless of car type or venue, although I do draw the line at getting up at 3 am to watch a Chinese F1 race. I listen to NASCAR satellite radio in my car and I personally attend several races, dirt track midgets and sprints, every year.
Take a few pictures of the stands during those races and let's compare........
I have been a race fan for over 50 years, I don't know it all, but I know a bunch.
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Not to take gasoline out of the fire , I have 2 words for you . "Restrictor plate." Elliot went faster in a Tbird at Talledega than the Daytona Chargers did at either Tallegega or Daytona and he did it with a 351-358 cubic inch engine not a 426 , 427 , or 429 . With the increase in the cornering speeds between 1970 and now , even with the smaller engines , if you took off the restrictor plates they should go between 228 and 235 depending on the drag curve at those speeds . I doubt the teams have drag numbers for speeds that high because they wouldn't waste the time and money spent on wind tunnel time to test that far out of the operating range . That being said you can take the current top speed and the restrictor plate HP numbers and conservatively project a speed based on the normal output of an un-restricted Sprint Cup engine .
if someone wants to dig for the fastest recorded number for a NASCAR race car Tim Richmond went something like 242 in a Monte Carlo Aerocoupe at TRC . He was actually faster than Al Holbert's Porsche 962 . Even that was about 100-150 horsepower ago .
Although I am now moderately disabled, [severe enough to allow a handicapped parking permit], and personal attendance at events with large crowds and extensive walking/standing is difficult.
Not to take gasoline out of the fire , I have 2 words for you . "Restrictor plate." Elliot went faster in a Tbird at Talledega than the Daytona Chargers did at either Tallegega or Daytona and he did it with a 351-358 cubic inch engine not a 426 , 427 , or 429 . With the increase in the cornering speeds between 1970 and now , even with the smaller engines , if you took off the restrictor plates they should go between 228 and 235 depending on the drag curve at those speeds . I doubt the teams have drag numbers for speeds that high because they wouldn't waste the time and money spent on wind tunnel time to test that far out of the operating range . That being said you can take the current top speed and the restrictor plate HP numbers and conservatively project a speed based on the normal output of an un-restricted Sprint Cup engine .
if someone wants to dig for the fastest recorded number for a NASCAR race car Tim Richmond went something like 242 in a Monte Carlo Aerocoupe at TRC . He was actually faster than Al Holbert's Porsche 962 . Even that was about 100-150 horsepower ago .
Getting back to the intent of the original post, I think the future Nationwide Camaro is as representative of the street version as the other three Nationwide brands allowing that NONE of them look like the car on the street. I also really doubt that NASCAR will ever go back to events where souped up street cars will dominate the tracks. Maybe a new organization will come along and give it a try but I won't hold my breath.
Realizing fully that this started out as a thread on the Nationwide car and drifted from there...
Everyone could take 1 step back and look up the 2013 Sprint Cup cars . While NASCAR is still trying to stay within the COT dictates they are making a big effort to give the cars brand distinction . You certainly will know the Fusion from the Dodge (if there is one) etc . I am not certain the new Chevy has broken cover yet in it's final form . Same for the Toyota .
The problem....
Linear Mode
