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  #1  
Old 02-11-2019, 09:37 AM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Default Slot.It GT-40 MKII stock tires, C1 compound?

I have been trying to get my Slot.It 956s to run competitively with my other cars, all on stock rubber tires. Many of those cars are pretty mundane yet the 956s are the third from slowest cars I own.
I believe they come with C1 compound tires, correct?
I have experimented with other rubber tires and the cars were faster but then they gradually came back to the previous lap times, and even slower then the C1 tires in some cases.

The track is about 65ft, routed MDF and the finish is latex, not shiny and not flat, somewhere in between, pretty similar to most. I do not use any treatment on any tires or the track and only occasionally run some urethanes but would say I run 95%+ rubber tires.

So, I have wanted to buy some other Slot.It cars for a while but the performance of the 956s has held me back. I will add that I have been able to get the cars to run great with silicones but that was just a test as I do not like to use them. I have also gotten them to run good on urethane tires but it seems they are not consistent as well.

I just bought a GT-40 MKII. After running 20 cars for 20 laps each I took the GT-40 out of the box and without doing a single thing to it, it shattered my track record by a large margin.
I realize that it is completely different then a 956 but this is what I always expected out of a Slot.It car.

The tires are threaded on the GT-40 but the only Slot.It tires I can find for that car say they are C1 compound. If that is the case I don't understand how tires of the same compound can run so differently, even taking into account the different cars. I am talking a 4+ second difference. The 956s are older then the GT-40, did the C1 compound change over the years?

Well if you have taken the time to read this and have any insight I would appreciate it.

Thanks, Rich
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  #2  
Old 02-11-2019, 06:16 PM
Wet Coast Racer Wet Coast Racer is offline
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The earliest Slot.it 956 cars certainly didn't come with C1's. I'm not sure, but I think they used P1's or P2's maybe. Use this link to get to the Slot.it site, then click on 'Models' then 'Gruppo C' - all the build details are listed there for each car, under the 'Spare Parts' link.

In the echoing corridors of my memory, I think the Gulf GT40 may in fact have been the first Slot.it to use C1's (anybody?) and from that point on all new Slot.it releases used them.

And picking up a stock 'Canon' car from my shelf (which is so old, the Spare Parts aren't listed on the site) and it doesn't feel like those original rear tires would be worth putting on a track, even after sanding.

Separately, I'm sure that those earlier Group C cars had a lot more mass in the body than the current offerings. And comparison to the GT-40 amounts to much more than a tire difference, when you look at how nimble the ford is, with a lower pod and sidewinder setup as well as C1's.

Which 956 have you got, and what blueprinting and tuning have you done with the chassis so far?

Last edited by Wet Coast Racer; 02-11-2019 at 06:24 PM.
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  #3  
Old 02-11-2019, 08:24 PM
SlotsNZ SlotsNZ is offline
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Default A little more information

It would help advise you well if we had more information

What cars DO have good grip on your track?
What tyres are they running?
How dusty, dirty, is the track environment?
What is the temperature variation in your track room?
What is your track cleaning regime as regards dust, solvents, wet clean & wipe etc?
When driving, especially after the track hasn't been used a few days, what do you do to clean car tyres?


One thing I would say is, urethanes shed tyre dust, so do some other soft rubber tyres, but they also lay down "rubber" over time.
Silicon tyres scrub a track, removing rubber buildup that helps grip long term [ do not believe anyone who gives you the alternate theory that Silicons lay down a silicon film o the the track, reducing grip. which is categorically not true, both from my chemical background, and long practical experimentation some years back. ] Regardless of that, there is a limit as to the compatibility of running silicon and "rubber" tyres on the same track. - I do a few, but I run a solvent cleaned track.

Last edited by SlotsNZ; 02-11-2019 at 08:28 PM.
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  #4  
Old 02-13-2019, 04:15 PM
Wicker Bill Wicker Bill is offline
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I have a wood track, too, and find that completely cleaning the tires with lighter fluid helped immensely.

Last edited by Wicker Bill; 02-13-2019 at 10:31 PM.
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  #5  
Old 02-13-2019, 06:47 PM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wet Coast Racer View Post
The earliest Slot.it 956 cars certainly didn't come with C1's. I'm not sure, but I think they used P1's or P2's maybe. Use this link to get to the Slot.it site, then click on 'Models' then 'Gruppo C' - all the build details are listed there for each car, under the 'Spare Parts' link.

In the echoing corridors of my memory, I think the Gulf GT40 may in fact have been the first Slot.it to use C1's (anybody?) and from that point on all new Slot.it releases used them.

And picking up a stock 'Canon' car from my shelf (which is so old, the Spare Parts aren't listed on the site) and it doesn't feel like those original rear tires would be worth putting on a track, even after sanding.

Separately, I'm sure that those earlier Group C cars had a lot more mass in the body than the current offerings. And comparison to the GT-40 amounts to much more than a tire difference, when you look at how nimble the ford is, with a lower pod and sidewinder setup as well as C1's.

Which 956 have you got, and what blueprinting and tuning have you done with the chassis so far?
I realize the cars are completely different, I just can't get over how slow the 956 is, and when I finally tried another Slot.It car (the GT40) I was blown away by its performance.

I run two 956s, a Hugo Boss 956 LH, and a 956 KH. They run almost exactly the same. I go back and forth testing wheels and tires and again, they are interchangeable as far as lap times.

I don't do anything exotic to any of my cars. I just fix whatever might be wrong and get them to run as best I can in stock form. I almost never even ad weight. Again, it amazes me what cars run faster then the 956s and I certainly didn't do anything special for them to be faster. Maybe I will try a newer 956 or 962 and see how they run if they have a different tire compound?
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  #6  
Old 02-13-2019, 07:19 PM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlotsNZ View Post
It would help advise you well if we had more information

What cars DO have good grip on your track?
What tyres are they running?
How dusty, dirty, is the track environment?
What is the temperature variation in your track room?
What is your track cleaning regime as regards dust, solvents, wet clean & wipe etc?
When driving, especially after the track hasn't been used a few days, what do you do to clean car tyres?


One thing I would say is, urethanes shed tyre dust, so do some other soft rubber tyres, but they also lay down "rubber" over time.
Silicon tyres scrub a track, removing rubber buildup that helps grip long term [ do not believe anyone who gives you the alternate theory that Silicons lay down a silicon film o the the track, reducing grip. which is categorically not true, both from my chemical background, and long practical experimentation some years back. ] Regardless of that, there is a limit as to the compatibility of running silicon and "rubber" tyres on the same track. - I do a few, but I run a solvent cleaned track.
Aside from the GT40, my Sideways 935/78 probably has the most consistent good grip (it is odd as I believe it uses Slot.It tires?), The Thunderslot Lola would be next and believe it or not most of my old Fly cars have good grip. Scaleauto is decent also. I can get great grip with freshly sanded urethanes and some Slot.it tires but after some laps (100 or so?) the urethanes and Slot.it tires seem to loose grip.

They are all running stock rubber tires (the tires that came on the car when it was new) and in the case of many of the Fly cars the tires are older then the 956. Just for the heck of it I did a light sanding on the tires on a Fly 908 Flunder which are the hardest, worst tires of any car that I own. The 908 consistently laps just quicker then the 956.

The room is not dirty or dusty at all.

The temperature only varies between 65 and 70 degrees.

I only clean the track with a damp microfibre towel. I never use any solvents on the track. I also never use anything on any tires.

I only use tape to clean the tires.

Just to be clear, when talking about how the 956 runs compared to other cars, the testing is/was done at the same time under the same conditions.

As far as silicones, after I use them for 20 laps the track is definitely slower for cars that run after the silicones. I have not used them for a while and generally do not use them.
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  #7  
Old 02-13-2019, 07:20 PM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wicker Bill View Post
I have a wood track, too, and fthen one that completely cleaning the tires with lighter fluid helped immensely.
What type of tires do you use?
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  #8  
Old 02-13-2019, 08:14 PM
glen glen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GT3Racerich View Post
What type of tires do you use?
Slot It makes both N22 and F22 that work nicely on wood tracks and are easy to glue and true.
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  #9  
Old 02-13-2019, 10:37 PM
Wicker Bill Wicker Bill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GT3Racerich View Post
What type of tires do you use?
I mostly use Paul Gage urethanes. My rally cars use Slot.It P6.
I pulled a Slot.It IMSA 962 out tonight to take for a spin. The rear end slid around like it was on ice. I put some lighter fluid on a piece of paper towel, then the towel on the track, and lowered the rear of the car under power. Tons of crud came off and car ran great after the cleaning.
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  #10  
Old 02-14-2019, 07:41 AM
RichD RichD is offline
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Some years back the tires that came on Slot.it RTR cars were not the same as any of the ones that were sold separately, perhaps that has changed. My experience has been that there are often batch to batch variations in rubber tires, especially the ones that come on RTR cars, and those can affect both their grip and service life. The grip of rubber tires can often be improved by various treatments like 3in1 oil or NSR tire conditioner, but we found that what worked with one pair of tires might be less effective with tires from another batch. When you are running formal races you would like to have a level playing field, so we have standardized on using silicone tires . My club does run a lot of proxy races and we are aware that any sort of tire can be made to work well providing that the track has been conditioned properly. In a club type setting you would be better off sticking with one type of tire. If you must mix them rubber and urethane tires play well together.

The OP stated that the car was slow. "Slow" is a vague term if you are trying to diagnose problems over the Internet. I presume that in this case the problem is poor handling rather than lack of power. If a car does not handle well the tires are likely to be part of the problem. A quick way to rule that out is to swap the wheels/tires from a similar car that runs well. If your lap times come down you will be sure that the tires are part of the problem. Otherwise I have found that plastic chassis 1/32nd cars can be tricky to tune and that just a fraction of a turn of a body or motor pod screw can make a difference.
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  #11  
Old 02-15-2019, 07:27 AM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glen View Post
Slot It makes both N22 and F22 that work nicely on wood tracks and are easy to glue and true.
I have some F22s but have not tried them yet. Do you find that they are pretty consistent or do they get slower with use?
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  #12  
Old 02-15-2019, 07:29 AM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wicker Bill View Post
I mostly use Paul Gage urethanes. My rally cars use Slot.It P6.
I pulled a Slot.It IMSA 962 out tonight to take for a spin. The rear end slid around like it was on ice. I put some lighter fluid on a piece of paper towel, then the towel on the track, and lowered the rear of the car under power. Tons of crud came off and car ran great after the cleaning.
My tires don't seem to get that dirty. Does the lighter fluid leave any residue on the track?
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  #13  
Old 02-15-2019, 07:40 AM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichD View Post
Some years back the tires that came on Slot.it RTR cars were not the same as any of the ones that were sold separately, perhaps that has changed. My experience has been that there are often batch to batch variations in rubber tires, especially the ones that come on RTR cars, and those can affect both their grip and service life. The grip of rubber tires can often be improved by various treatments like 3in1 oil or NSR tire conditioner, but we found that what worked with one pair of tires might be less effective with tires from another batch. When you are running formal races you would like to have a level playing field, so we have standardized on using silicone tires . My club does run a lot of proxy races and we are aware that any sort of tire can be made to work well providing that the track has been conditioned properly. In a club type setting you would be better off sticking with one type of tire. If you must mix them rubber and urethane tires play well together.

The OP stated that the car was slow. "Slow" is a vague term if you are trying to diagnose problems over the Internet. I presume that in this case the problem is poor handling rather than lack of power. If a car does not handle well the tires are likely to be part of the problem. A quick way to rule that out is to swap the wheels/tires from a similar car that runs well. If your lap times come down you will be sure that the tires are part of the problem. Otherwise I have found that plastic chassis 1/32nd cars can be tricky to tune and that just a fraction of a turn of a body or motor pod screw can make a difference.
Both 956s are slow because of the tires. As I have said previously I have exhaustivly swapped tires. I have been able to get them to run great with some other Slot.It tires and urethanes but the performance falls off with use. I am not looking to make it the fastest car on earth, I would like to find a tire that will make it more competitive, but I want consistency. The only thing I have now is consistently slow compared to 90% of my other cars, all on their stock rubber tires.
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  #14  
Old 02-15-2019, 10:15 AM
jaws jaws is offline
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I had about the same problem a while back, I had a Slot.it 956 that wouldn't keep running the same. It would run like the other cars, then it would slow down. I would put new tires on it and then the same thing it would slow down again. What I found was the tires expand from "racing" and would loose their grip on the wheels after some laps. I was using Slot.it tires at the time. Once I "glued" a set of tires on the wheels, the car has run good since.

Jim W
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  #15  
Old 02-15-2019, 02:39 PM
GT3Racerich GT3Racerich is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaws View Post
I had about the same problem a while back, I had a Slot.it 956 that wouldn't keep running the same. It would run like the other cars, then it would slow down. I would put new tires on it and then the same thing it would slow down again. What I found was the tires expand from "racing" and would loose their grip on the wheels after some laps. I was using Slot.it tires at the time. Once I "glued" a set of tires on the wheels, the car has run good since.

Jim W
I actually was wondering about that. I was going to mark the wheels and tires with paint to see if there was any movement but never did. I will do that tonight and report back.
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