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  • I don't need stewards interpretation to tell me what was seen, LH was on a line converging towards the corner not away from it, since when is it a written requirement to stick to an apex? This isn't a computer game with an ideal racing line highlighted in blue.
    We saw in car footage, MV turned right then straightened then turned even sharper right when alongside LH. If you want to turn right when there's already another car there you're going to collide with it.
    Stewards aren't God, we've seen them make ridiculous decisions over the years, we're allowed an alternative opinion, I prefer to base mine on facts and without prejudice.

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      • I see that Mercedes aren't done complaining about the penalty.

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        • The reality is that a senior Mercedes person answers question mid-week, and then the BBC and other media use what is said to create headlines/articles/controversy.

          The most recent video where Mercedes do that is in the post directly above yours.

          James Allison is a calm and measured guy, and you can see this in the video. There is no 'complaining', just a guy putting his side of things with aplomb.

          Always go to the source. Especially when there is VT.

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          • Originally posted by Kevan View Post
            I don't need stewards interpretation to tell me what was seen, , I prefer to base mine on facts and without prejudice.
            I'm always mindful of some things when talking about stewards decisions:

            They have far more data ('facts') than we do.
            They aren't partial. Most fans are, and I include us in that.
            They have exhaustively read the rules, and have them to hand. I doubt either statements are true for either of us.
            They aren't to blame for a penalty being applied that some fans are not happy with, the rules are.

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            • Originally posted by NicoRosberg. View Post
              The reality is that a senior Mercedes person answers question mid-week, and then the BBC and other media use what is said to create headlines/articles/controversy.
              Yes. I'm 66 years old, and well familiar with how the media work.

              But is there anything that's factually incorrect in Andrew Benson's article? I think not. It presents Mercedes' view of the matter very well, as articulated in that video you posted.

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              • Originally posted by Wet Coast Racer View Post
                Yes. I'm 66 years old, and well familiar with how the media work.

                But is there anything that's factually incorrect in Andrew Benson's article? I think not. It presents Mercedes' view of the matter very well, as articulated in that video you posted.
                Nothing wrong with Benson's article at all. He isn't great, a bit too by-the-numbers, but he isn't terrible.

                It is your interpretation from reading a text article with your partiality that I didn't agree with.

                It is clear from the video that Benson uses as his source that Mercedes are not 'complaining'.

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                • Originally posted by NicoRosberg. View Post
                  It is clear from the video that Benson uses as his source that Mercedes are not 'complaining'.
                  OK, now I understand.

                  Apparently, referring to a penalty as 'harsh', several days after the race has run, is a joyous expression of satisfaction with the steward's decision. Silly me!

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                  • I think your understanding is diminishing.

                    The questions JA is answering in the video were probably sent in on Sunday, answers were formulated on Monday and the finished product is released on a Wednesday.

                    In no part of the finished product is anyone moaning.

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                    • I said 'complaining', not moaning.

                      But I think JA is incorrect in calling the penalty 'harsh'. Because in my view - and this should be Mercedes' view - the penalty was inappropriate. This was a racing incident.

                      And both the current Mercedes clip that you posted, and the Benson item, were posted within hours of each other. And frankly, I think we can expect more of the same as the season goes on, including the rancor between Christian & Toto. So that's my opinion, we'll see if I'm right or not.

                      Your condescending attitude becomes irritating after a while.

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                      • I'm not condescending.

                        The Benson article was cribbed from the comments JA made, and, of course, posted quickly. Not sure what your point is there.

                        In no part of the comments JA makes was he complaining or moaning. In all the Wednesday vids Mercedes put out their guys are calm and erudite.

                        The stewards have a lot more data than we do with which to determine racing incidents. There are diagrams they teams have been given, not seen by the public for one thing. These have been mentioned this week by Brundle, Hughes and Autosport. Then there is the whole business of leaving a car's width in battle, which I assume is measured from your normal line.

                        Hamilton wasn't on his.

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                        • Originally posted by NicoRosberg. View Post

                          This is a quote from the steward's decision:

                          ''Car 44 was on a line that did not reach the apex of the corner, with room available to the inside''
                          Going back to this gem of irrelevance, so the stewards are now fortune tellers gazing into their crystal balls predicting something that may happen in the future and using it as evidence when justifying their penalty decision....except the collision happened before the apex, anything that theoretically might have happened shouldn't have any bearing whatsoever on their decision but it sounds as though it did.
                          I've heard Mystic Meg is available for work...

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                          • Originally posted by Kevan View Post
                            I've heard Mystic Meg is available for work...
                            I know a guy who used to go out with a clairvoyant, but things didn't work out for them. I thought at the time that she should have seen it coming ...

                            Meanwhile, F1 Race Director Michael Masi appears to be in contradiction with himself as to whether team bosses should accost (sorry, make that visit) the stewards during a race. Here's Andrew Benson reporting on that issue.

                            (Please note, this being the internet, and the news being 'old' by now because it's been reported somewhere else, I do apologize for wasting your time if this is the case.)

                            Personally, I think it's just nuts for team bosses to feel so entitled. If the stewards make the 'right' call, then great. If the stewards make the 'wrong' call, well it happens. There's nothing like the 20/20 vision of hindsight.

                            You cannot have the referees being lobbied during the game (whatever the game) by those with a self-interest in how things are adjudicated.

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                            • Where is the contradiction?

                              He invited Wolff, Horner invited himself.

                              Lots of sports have the combatants lobbying officialdom.

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                              • Originally posted by Kevan View Post

                                so the stewards are now fortune tellers gazing into their crystal balls
                                No, but they can see the line that Hamilton has taken in the past. In the lead up to the collision, Hamilton wasn't on it.

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