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  • I'd say as soon as safely possible, within the current lap they are in or, if they are in the second half of a course, once they pass the start/finish before they are half way around again. The only wrinkle might be when they are in the final lap or something.

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    • Verstappen brake checked Hamilton and received a 10 second penalty that meant nothing, so Max effectively got away with dangerous driving. In the next race, he'll win or crash and if he crashes, he won't crash alone.

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      • Originally posted by SouthShoreRacing View Post
        Verstappen brake checked Hamilton and received a 10 second penalty that meant nothing, so Max effectively got away with dangerous driving. In the next race, he'll win or crash and if he crashes, he won't crash alone.
        100% accurate. Max has proven he’s willing to take dangerous driving straight to Lewis. That’s just a fact. Lost all respect for Max. It is one thing to be an aggressive driver. Lewis is very aggressive. I don’t need to explain the difference between the aggressive style of the two. I hope Bottas takes to Max’s aggressive driving style and they start right next to each other. Beat Max at his own game. Because Max will absolutely not race Lewis straight up and clean.

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        • Originally posted by SouthShoreRacing View Post
          Verstappen brake checked Hamilton and received a 10 second penalty that meant nothing, so Max effectively got away with dangerous driving.
          The penalties are not given with the consequences in in mind, which totally makes sense, but I wish this once it had been.

          Change the 10 to a 20, and we get a much bigger chance of a clean race on Sunday.

          Last edited by NicoRosberg.; 12-08-2021, 09:11 AM.

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          • Originally posted by SouthShoreRacing View Post
            Verstappen brake checked Hamilton and received a 10 second penalty that meant nothing, so Max effectively got away with dangerous driving. In the next race, he'll win or crash and if he crashes, he won't crash alone.
            On the other hand, after watching multiple views of the incident, it sure seems that initially, Max just lifted sharply on the throttle while moving over to give the position back, but Lewis - instead of zipping past, like he would with any backmarker; instead, he doggedly stuck to the back end of the Red Bull. They were each playing a strategic game, based on the DRS line.

            Just because Hamiton may not have received notice that Verstappen would have to give the place back doesn't mean that he wasn't anticipating it. Good grief, he's won 103 F1 races, he's been around the block. So I reckon he was deliberately hanging back there in the certain anticipation of what was happening. At that point Max just wanted to shake him off, and actually did dab the brakes after dropping five gears already, because Lewis resolutely failed to go by.

            It must be kept in mind that if a driver is ordered to give a place back, it's expected that they will be reasonably expedient about it.



            What a season, can't wait for the finale in Abu Dhabi!
            Last edited by Wet Coast Racer; 12-08-2021, 04:29 PM.

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            • I like your take on it and think it is the most plausible explanation. Both drivers are big boys and knew what they were doing.

              Originally posted by Wet Coast Racer View Post

              On the other hand, after watching multiple views of the incident, it sure seems that initially, Max just lifted sharply on the throttle while moving over to give the position back, but Lewis - instead of zipping past, like he would with any backmarker; instead, he doggedly stuck to the back end of the Red Bull. They were each playing a strategic game, based on the DRS line.

              Just because Hamiton may not have received notice that Verstappen would have to give the place back doesn't mean that he wasn't anticipating it. Good grief, he's won 103 F1 races, he's been around the block. So I reckon he was deliberately hanging back there in the certain anticipation of what was happening. At that point Max just wanted to shake him off, and actually did dab the brakes after dropping five gears already, because Lewis resolutely failed to go by.

              It must be kept in mind that if a driver is ordered to give a place back, it's expected that they will be reasonably expedient about it.



              What a season, can't wait for the finale in Abu Dhabi!

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              • A reminder. Hamilton didn’t need “permission “ to pass Max. The moment Max slowed on that straight Lewis should have blown by him. That he hesitated and acted all confused about the situation kinda gives away his motivation. There was no ambiguity in Verstappen’s slowing.

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                • You can't know if that is all that happened, or even if it happened.

                  Hamilton has said the looming DRS detection zone was in his thinking after he came upon the Red Bull, but that at the time he was confused, and wary of what Max might do next (such as brake check and then try and scamper away perhaps). Some or all of that could be lies. We know the team had not told him anything.

                  Only Hamilton knows what he was really thinking and doing.

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                  • Originally posted by Wet Coast Racer View Post

                    and actually did dab the brakes after dropping five gears already, because Lewis resolutely failed to go by.
                    It was more than a dab.

                    The FIA has now had multiple chances to ensure the last race is clean. I'm not saying they are trying to create anything, but it is a shame nobody looks at the bigger picture when handing out penalties.

                    Max know has a whole raft of things he can risk, Hamilton, due to his reprimand situation, has none.

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                    • Originally posted by NicoRosberg. View Post
                      Only Hamilton knows what he was really thinking and doing.
                      True, that.

                      But generally speaking, if you're on the road and you crash into the guy in front, it's because you weren't paying attention to what was going on ahead. This, however, is not the case on the race track.

                      Lewis was paying acute attention to the developing situation ahead. There can't be any doubt about that ...

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                      • Yes, there can.

                        He says he was confused initially, then wary, then figured this was about the DRS. That could all be lies, that could all be true, or some mixture.

                        Only he knows.

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                        • We'll never know for sure, but again, Hamilton did not need permission to pass. That he didn't just blow by the slowing car, but rather, tailgated it and then crashed into the back of it puts half of the liability on him. He's way too good of a driver to simply committed a "teenager sending a text while driving" kind of error.

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                          • They were both playing a game because neither wanted to be in the lead when they crossed the DRS line. I think Max went too far when he rapidly slowed down. From what I read it was a negative 2.4g brake event which is not just a tap on the brakes.

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                            • Quite how he got a only ten second penalty for that I don't know/

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                              • Originally posted by downtowndeco View Post
                                //////tailgated it and then crashed into the back of it puts half of the liability on him....
                                Yet the stewards put none on him.

                                He had no idea what was happening. Bear in mind he was investigated for ignoring a yellow panel the day before, when in fact there wasn't one on his dash. Maybe he thought a VSC had been called, maybe he just feared Max would swipe him.

                                Given he is one reprimand away from his whole season being wrecked, and they are quite easy to pick up, I can see why he would be cautious.

                                We will never know exactly what he was thinking.

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