Pix of work on GPR cars

[bartbrn]

Now, was the MkIIIB coupe of '69-'70 significantly wider than the earlier version?

The Fly model is 2.5" wide, or 80" if it is in 1/32, or 75" wide if it is in 1/30. If the real car is 74" wide, the Fly model scales out as too wide, even for our 1/30 allowance. Wheelbase is 101", 3.155" on the model.

This is hardly definitive, but roving around the net, including Lola's and Lola Heritage's site, here's what I've come up with. BTW, these numbers agree with the ECRA's 12/68 "Scrutineer's Dimensions" handbook (the Lola MkIIIb had already been shown, but not yet raced).

Lola T70 MkIIIb specs. Dimensions in parentheses are 1/32 values:

WB = 95" (2.96")
OA Width = 74" (2.3125")
OA Length = sources vary from 165.35" (5.167") to 168" (5.25")
Height = sources vary from 38" (1.1875") to 39" (1.218")
Front track = sources vary from 57" to 58" (1.781" to 1.8125")
Rear track = sources vary from 57.5" to 58" (1.796" to 1.8125")

It's interesting and instructive (and BIG FUN!) to look at these modern reconstructions of the Mk111b, especially the strange aspect (sorry) of the Avon tires in the top two photos below, while from as near as dammit to the same angle shot of the Penske/Sunoco resto-rod has unknown tires which are far more upright:


Meanwhilst, Hier ist zwei fotos of (admittedly modern vintage-racer) T70 rear fenders (note the gauche modern mirror on the droit fender... What Gaul!):



Finally, for your consideration, we have some fine shots from the May/June 2002 issue of Vintage Motorsport, which is sadly devoid of specifications:




For what it's worth...

Bart

[Robert Livingston]

Lola T70 Mk IIIB OUT of GPR?

Thanks for that Bart, it looks like a scale 1" overwidth will be putting the Fly Classic Lola T70 coupe "out" of GPR.

Is anyone else but me trying to prepare one for GPR?

[PeteN95]

it looks like a scale 1" overwidth will be putting the Fly Classic Lola T70 coupe "out" of GPR.

Don't you mean a scale 6", because the model scales to 80" and the real car is 74"? I am now worried that any Fly cars are going to be legal!? I am going to be very bummed if I burn and cut my fingers making a brass chassis, only to find out the body is illegal! How are we supposed to know this? Do you know if any/how many of the cars listed on your rules are legal or illegal?!

[Robert Livingston]

The rules allow a model up to 1/30 scale, and in 1/30 scale, the Fly Lola is still a scale inch too wide.

The Geenwood Corvette was supposedly 84" wide; in 1/30 scale it would be a massive 2.8" wide. We do have a 2.6" width limit in GPR, regardless of scale.

The Carrera model of the Porsche RSR Turbo has already been outlawed, unless you cut it down.

I think if a person chooses a body, and it is 2.5" or wider, it behooves them to do some research to see what the actual dimensions are. The rules are clear enough. AND, (and this is important), if the car body is on our GPR Body List you can run it, even if we find out later that it is too wide.

[Robert Livingston]

The too-wide Lola:


Three large holes in the tail cut out at the top, to look closer to actual photos. Tail lights yet to be re-installed. This body is tail heavy:


Brass plate went through some design evolution. Holes drilled for lightness. Car now weighs 104 grams, handles and accelerates as if it is still too heavy. Body mounts still in progress. Car easily clears 1/16" underneath.


Original Fly motor pod pivots on longitudinal pin inside a length of brass tubing, is transversally sprung on a crosswise length of .032" music wire. Without the spring, car hopped badly. With spring, car is smooth. Dummy Chevy motor glued atop FK motor, moves with rear pod inside cutout hole in rear deck:


I think I have pushed this design as far as I can. Lap times still not so hot: 5.264 sec best, 5.4's usually (fast time for TSRF and Slot.It cars is 5.0 flat, with excursions to 4.9). Next step is to adapt the chassis to another body, lighter in the tail, and of course slightly narrower. Good thing I am on vacation!

[Wet Coast Racer]

Some clever work went into that car, Robert - thanks for the pictures.

Two thoughts cross my mind (and at the same time too, quite frightening). Are you still running your track at a relatively low voltage, so only a real lightweight car or something with a red can will leap around ... and is it possible you're concentrating too much on laptimes without also taking into account driveability and stability under proxy conditions?

[Robert Livingston]

I am testing on 13.6v, so the cars will misbehave and be hard to drive, if they are so inclined. A lot of handling vices disappear if you dial down the voltage.

I am trying for a driveable car that is also very fast. I have two here that I compare to: Fly Racing Porsche GT1-98 with modified floating pod, and a nearly stock Pro Slot Toyota GT-1 with FK motor. Also, a couple of Slot.It's (956 and Sauber) and a modified TSRF, all fast cars, and not bad drivers, either.

[RECKLESSRACER]

cool adaptation of fly plastic technology, RL. Disappointing to hear it's not the fastest thing out of east new york raceway!

I have to throw in my humble opinion here ..... Gpers, if rules and regs are going to be so stringent as to toss out something as good lookin' as a Fly Lola [well, I like them], how many cars are going to make it in? I had originally planned to enter the VRAA, but that proxy seemed to get so bogged down with inches and mm's that I just couldn't be bothered trying to sort it out. I don't want to race thingies, but I don't want to have to count rivets either No disrepect to the organizers of either event, you guys are maestros .... but for the average joe [or recklessracer] it can get a bit daunting to just put together a toy car that runs without stripping the crown gear! I sure hope the Fly 908 I'm working on isn't 1/29th scale I will now Send The Ferrari Up my track, and go chase some Lolas ....

[Wet Coast Racer]

The Fly 908 should be a good choice for you, Eric. Sidewinders rarely strip their gears ...

[Robert Livingston]

Eric, any body type on our approved GPR list will be admissable in the GPR, superceding any considerations of scale. That includes th "bathtub" Fly 908. So by my own ruling, I could enter the Fly Lola, cuz it's already on the list.

The last thing we want to do in the GPR is jack up some racers who spend alot of time building, and then get their cars ruled out. No good!

So please be sure your intended entry is on the list, and if it isn't, please tell us what you would like to run.

cool adaptation of fly plastic technology, RL. Disappointing to hear it's not the fastest thing out of east new york raceway!

I have to throw in my humble opinion here ..... Gpers, if rules and regs are going to be so stringent as to toss out something as good lookin' as a Fly Lola [well, I like them], how many cars are going to make it in? I had originally planned to enter the VRAA, but that proxy seemed to get so bogged down with inches and mm's that I just couldn't be bothered trying to sort it out. I don't want to race thingies, but I don't want to have to count rivets either No disrepect to the organizers of either event, you guys are maestros .... but for the average joe [or recklessracer] it can get a bit daunting to just put together a toy car that runs without stripping the crown gear! I sure hope the Fly 908 I'm working on isn't 1/29th scale I will now Send The Ferrari Up my track, and go chase some Lolas ....

[PeteN95]

Robert, a couple things, first here is a pic of my Topslot Lola, which measures 2.383" at the widest point. I was just installing the correct T70 wheels, because I want to use the Porsche wheels in the pic on my GPR car. So I measured it. It seemed narrow next to my other Fly classics. It has an MRRC 275p chassis.



Second, how do you cut your brass chassis'? I have yet to start and was pondering the wheel of death and wondering if I had a jigsaw somewhere? Your Lola and Toy GT1 look very nice!

[dr vanski]

Global Proxy Trippin'

I've been looking back at the various GPR threads both here and abroad lately. Based on what I've seen in them as well as emails I've received the grid is shaping up nicely. Below is a list of some of the cars we can hope to see in this race around the world...er...globe...with multiple examples of some of the machines mentioned.

The GT class so far:

• Chevrolet Corvette
• Ferrari Daytona
• Ford Capri
• Ford Maverick
• Ford Mustang
• Jaguar E-Type
• Porsche 911

The Prototype class so far:

• Porsche 906
• Porsche 908
• Porsche 917k
• Porsche 936
• Chapparal 2J
• Ferrari 312P
• Ferrari 312PB
• Lola T70 Mk III

I'd pay to see a race of these cars! I wonder what's cooking in the basements and garages of Slovenia....???

[Robert Livingston]

That is a good looking list.
My Lola will possibly be reconfigured into a Ferrari 512S. Have Fly body for this.

I am expecting to build up an MRRC Toyota LB Turbo Group 5 into something for GT. Currently it is in box-stock form, with the dreaded Red Can. That is not good.

[RECKLESSRACER]

The last thing we want to do in the GPR is jack up some racers who spend alot of time building, and then get their cars ruled out. No good!

thanks for the clarification on the body rules, RL. Now if I can just shoehorn that red can in the 908 .....

[bartbrn]

Thanks for that Bart, it looks like a scale 1" overwidth will be putting the Fly Classic Lola T70 coupe "out" of GPR.

Is anyone else but me trying to prepare one for GPR?

Yeah, me -- hoist upon the pétard of my own enthusiasm for digging out the gen. That scale 6" overwidth translates to 3/16" in 1/32 -- it's easy to see how the slotracers of the later '60s tottered own the garden path (aka "The Road To Perdition") with their 2-1/2" "handling bodies" -- BTW, (just a historical point, NOT stirring the pot) ECRA's accepted tolerance back then was 1/16" actual (on the slot car), 3x that would have gotten you stripped of rank and forced to run a gauntlet of 12 acne-encrusted slotracers, who would whip you the while with the knotted cords of MRC controllers. THAT'S gotta hurt!

I agree that the Fly Lola falls comfortably within the 1/30 rule (though if you call it 1/30, then many other dimensions are out of scale the other way!).

May I suggest as another GT candidate the BMW 3.5CSL, which has been made by both Fly and Scalextric? Alzo, I measure the widest point of the Monogram Greenwood Corvette as 2.44", which I cipher to the rule of 32 as 78.08", or 1.98m -- near enough to MODERN LM/ALMS disqualification!

When you say:

" The GT class so far:

• Chevrolet Corvette..."

I hope you are referring to both the "mild" Greenwood body mods, as exemplified by Scalextric's race number 57 Dave Heinz/Bob Johnson L-88, and the "Batmobile" Greenwood bods, as shown by the Monogram Greenwood Spirits of Sebring, Sebring West (Riverside), and Le Mans. Please advise...


Always willing to muddy a situation further, I remain

Yr fthfl & obdt servant,

Bart